volume control

[bill rand]

Hi folks just a quicky im after ideas on volume control heres the problem. In the band i like to have power selector set to 30w and the master to 3 oclock or there abouts the problem is that its too loud lol especially when using the eq and bbe pedals in the loop as both add volume.

Im looking to add a volume control either in line or in the loop to be able to maintain tube warmth with the master set where it is but be able to lower the volume some how with maybe a pedal.

I use a line6 compressor at the moment inline which has a level control , would this do the job if i set it below unity?, or maybe use it in the loop with the eq and bbe set the same way? Using the guitar volume pot or the volume pedal on the vc12 seems to alter the tone too much to my ears/ Any other suggestions would be much appreciated

Oh just to point out obviously there is the volume control used in saving patches but i have a pedal board full for the set and its taken me long enough to set these from patch to patch in the band mix to start lowering them again, and trying to get them all to sound good in the mix

[bclarke675]

Is it too quiet at the 15 watt setting? That seems like a better solution, if possible.

[bill rand]

Its not too quiet at 15w but i think the tone is better the more the attenuater is opened and the amp can open its lungs lol. Im thinking maybe a lead with an integral volume pot in it, or maybe a small box with a volume pot that could be put in the loop so that the volume to the speakers is affected but after any tone forming operations have been carried out both digital and through the power amp. i may get the soldering iron out and insert a volume pot into a patch cable with a treble bleed mod and see what happens.
I tried to lower the level on the comp pedal but again this affected the over all tone as it obviously decreased the level hitting the amp input

[Voxman]

Hi Bill - absoloutely agree that you need the power level upfor gigging/rehearsals to at least 30w or even the full 60w setting (which is what I use).

I think what you need is a true by-pass 'setable' volume pedal where you can set the pedal at the volume you want - plus you have the added bonus that if you set the 'heel' at the volume you want, and 'toe' at a higher volume - there's your uplift for solo's too! This type of pedal will let you globally set the overall volume with ease, but with no colouration of tone.

But as Shakespeare said "There lieth the rub" - becayse that's the tricky bit! - although most manufacturers advertise their gear as being 'true by-pass', very few in reality are. I'll have a look over the weekend to see if can point you in the right direction as to which pedal might fit the bill.

Also, remember your cables - a buffered cable might help more highs to get through.

Rich

[bill rand]

Thanks Rich, how do you find the volume pedal on the vc12 affects the tone of your patches? again to my ears it alters it? Im assuming that this also alters the volume before the power amp section of the amp. I suppose im thinking along the lines of creating a volume control in the loop like some amps have already fitted so i get the full warm tube tone of the master cranked ish, but with controllable input to the speaker.

[Voxman]

I've not noticed any tonal degradation when using the VC12 volume pedal Bill - in fact, I find it very transparent.

[bill rand]

OK guys i think ive cracked it lol, after an hour trying to insert a guitar volume pot into a patch cable. I suddenly remembered i have a small berhinger 502 mixer that i used to use in the loop to import mp3 backing tracks. I think if i insert this into the loop along with everything else i could set the attenuator to say 60w , the amp master to 3 oclock and use the volume controls either line or master on the mixer to the required volume i need for each gig..........i think lol. This should give me the tone you get with 60w selected along with a fairly saturated tube tone at lower volumes than possible with the amp controls alone, thoughts?

Just found what i was looking for its called a volume box attenuator, looks like my idea wont make me millions after all lol, anyway ive been thinking and i may have got this wrong i thought the loop came after the power amp section just before the feed to the speakers but now i think its between the pre amp stage and the power amp, so in theory all your doing by putting in a volume control is affecting the pre amp gain/volume feeding the power amp section and not the power amp its self so maybe my goals cant be achieved this way?

[bill rand]

Could Bob confirm this? thanks

[retrobob]

i think its between the pre amp stage and the power amp, so in theory all your doing by putting in a volume control is affecting the pre amp gain/volume feeding the power amp section and not the power amp its self so maybe my goals cant be achieved this way?

the loop is between the pre-amp and the tube (power amp) essentially what you are doing is the same as a master volume, the VC12 volume pedal does this already.

I use my VC12's volume pedal and place a small magnet under the heal of the pedal to limit its back swing so it can't go all the way off (use different sized magnets to adjust), this gives me a constant base line for the amp's volume level as the pedal always returns to the same spot, then I adjust the amp accordingly. When I need more volume I rock the pedal forward, when finished I rock it back, it always returns to the same spot where the magnet is and everything is back to normal. Limiting the pedal to the same spot every time reduces any tone changes, if there are any, they are too small for me to notice. It gives me the extra headroom when I need it.

[bill rand]

So there is no way of adjusting the final volume level produced by the speaker and maintaining the tube saturation im after ? see original post for explanation. I suppose i should be concentrating on practicing more than tone hunting , but it gets quite addictive lol.