Lows Get Flabby, Could Be The Cab?

[soundchaser59]

In my AD30VT-XL I have installed a Weber Michigan speaker. It should have a great low end that is always clear and clean, yet in this amp it gets a bit flabby if I push the bass knob too high on some models.

I don't think it's the speaker, if I mount it in some other bigger cabs, it sounds awesome!

I think it's the cab, perhaps it isn't quite big enough or deep enough to handle this speaker? Maybe this cab design isn't quite right for any big low end sounds?

Maybe this is a good reason to take the back off? Do you think that would help? Or do you think there is just enough space on the front baffle to make a hole to act as a small port?

[Voxman]

I think that taking the back off will make the bass more flabby - it's why the closed back Blue VTX amps replaced the open back Blue VT amps. However, it may be that you haven't got enough space to let the air move around, so you could try taking the back off and see how it sounds.

The stock speakers in the Valvetronix are more 'flat response' to suit modeling amps better. These colour tone less and allow the amp modeling to come through better. I'm not familiar with the Michigan Weber (or whether you went ceramic or alnico), but sometimes a speaker that sounds great in a big cab with a regular amp may not necessarily perform as well with a modeling amp in a small cab.

[Paragon]

The same speaker in a small cab will sound different when in a larger one.
Cabinet size, open/closed, speaker, EQ setting, power supplied/power rating will all make a difference in the response.
It is especially tricky in a modeling amp.
Simple solution is to roll off the Bass a bit if you are pleased with the rest of it's performance.

[soundchaser59]

I think the stock speaker is a Celestion of some sort?

Is there a different - better - Celestion (or maybe an Eminence?) that you think would work well in this amp for the modelling, etc.....something that maybe has a bit more balls and more guts than the stock, but will still be "honest" enough to handle the modeling well? Maybe it could handle an EV Force 12?

I think you might be right, the Webers are not designed for modelling amps, they are designed for guitars running thru tube amps. This amp should have something that is more toward the "hi fi" end of things? The stock sound isn't necessarily bad, it just doesn't seem to be able to handle everything the amp will put out. Is there a speaker that will?

[Voxman]

It's very difficult to give any advice on speakers because tone is so personal. The Celestion V30 is a perennial favourite with many players.

But perhaps you'll get more tonal/EQ flexibility and a richer fuller tone by adding an FX loop & putting an EQ and/or BBE Sonic Stomp Maximiser in the FX loop?

[soundchaser59]

I'm not sure an eq or sonic stomp would help. The tone knobs on the Vox are fine for everything I do, and the sonic stomp is more like a maximizer or a top boost, which I dont think I would really appreciate.

If I eq out some of the lows then the sound gets a bit thin quickly. I'd like to leave the lows up some without getting flabby at all, and that seems like a speaker and/or a cab size issue.

I'll put the stock speaker back in tomorrow after I'm done on stage and see how the sound changes. There are a couple three heavy duty Celestions available right now that are very tempting, with huge freq response range, high sensitivity rating, huge magnet and vc assembly, and the smooth cone with big paper cap that I like. If I can get the big one for under $100 I don't think I can resist the urge to test drive that.

[soundchaser59]

Well, I put the stock speaker back in and realized it will work (for my purposes) just fine. I will have to do some serious re-dialing and re-tweaking of my favorite settings, but the speaker will be ok. That Weber Michigan I had in there was overqualified for the job, and really belongs with a tube amp.

I noticed that the lows sounded thinner but cleaner with the back off. When I put the back on, the lows became bigger, but also sounded less clean and less defined. I think I can redial to get what I need. Mostly I'm just glad to have a 12 inch speaker instead of the 10 incher.

If I really need to use a different speaker with this amp, then I should mount a jack on it, instead of changing the internal speaker.

[soundchaser59]

I'm going to try putting a piece of 3 inch thick batting on the inside of the back panel. That works in my other cabs, might help here.

[soundchaser59]

FIXED IT!

I have always raved about how great the Eminence Delta Demon 10 incher sounds with the AD30VT.

Well, today I got my Eminence Texas Heat speaker. It's (imo) the 12 inch equivalent of the Delta Demon. It is awesome in this amp (AD30VTXL) a major improvement. I also stapled a couple layers of white batting to the inside back panel.

Best speaker I've tried with this amp, by far! Lows are clear and defined, everything is right where it should be tone wisse and response wise. This is tons of fun now!

Texas Heat is definitely a recommend for these amps!

[Voxman]

Funnily enough I wrote to Eminence asking about a good replacement speaker for my new Laney Cub 12R 1x12" combo and they recommended the Texas Heat to replace the stock Celestion Rocket 50.

Hi Rich - I think Texas Heat fits your description very well. It is very clean and warm with fat lows, crisp mids and good top end bite and clarity. It will give nice cut in the mids and good highs without being harsh. It will improve headroom dramatically over the Rocket 50. It will also give you more articulation on the lows, rather than muddiness, because it has a well defined low end.
Anthony Lucas | Sr. Lab Tech
Eminence Speaker LLC

I was also looking at the Eminence Governor. I can't tell much difference from the tone samples between the Governor and Texas Heat and as the Texas is much lighter it may well do the job nicely.

Rich